What is the value of points/miles?

Discussion in 'General Discussion | Miles/Points' started by garyst16, Apr 6, 2013.  |  Print Topic

  1. garyst16
    Original Member

    garyst16 Silver Member

    Messages:
    963
    Likes Received:
    1,028
    Status Points:
    825
    I sincerely apologize ahead of time if this question has been asked/answered - I did search but did not find another posting.

    My question is, has anyone put together a spreadsheet of the value of each of the major airlines and hotels mile/point value? I know this may be somewhat subjective, but thought that a few on this board have probably thought this out to the point that they have it recorded and wouldn't mind sharing the information.
     
    8MiHi, Kalboz and NYCUA1K like this.
  2. edekba

    edekba Gold Member

    Messages:
    3,462
    Likes Received:
    3,783
    Status Points:
    2,145
  3. garyst16
    Original Member

    garyst16 Silver Member

    Messages:
    963
    Likes Received:
    1,028
    Status Points:
    825
    Thanks, Edekba
     
    Kalboz, TravelBear and edekba like this.
  4. Steven Schwartz
    Original Member

    Steven Schwartz Gold Member

    Messages:
    1,017
    Likes Received:
    2,195
    Status Points:
    1,270
    All that said, good luck trying to get anyone to agree or even come close to a consensus!
     
    8MiHi, lovetofly, Kalboz and 6 others like this.
  5. edekba

    edekba Gold Member

    Messages:
    3,462
    Likes Received:
    3,783
    Status Points:
    2,145
    consensus no ... but a good starting point.
     
    garyst16 and TravelBear like this.
  6. HaveMilesWillTravel
    Original Member

    HaveMilesWillTravel Gold Member

    Messages:
    12,504
    Likes Received:
    20,199
    Status Points:
    16,520
    I am not even in agreement with myself on this.
     
  7. miles and smiles
    Original Member

    miles and smiles Gold Member

    Messages:
    17,531
    Likes Received:
    61,942
    Status Points:
    20,020
    Why would we want a consensus? How boring this world would be if we all valued things the same!
     
    8MiHi, SuperKirby, MX and 3 others like this.
  8. TravelBear

    TravelBear Gold Member

    Messages:
    1,038
    Likes Received:
    2,757
    Status Points:
    1,445
    Does agreeing with you make it a consensus, thus boring?
     
    garyst16 and miles and smiles like this.
  9. miles and smiles
    Original Member

    miles and smiles Gold Member

    Messages:
    17,531
    Likes Received:
    61,942
    Status Points:
    20,020
    Good one :)
    I already know that you and I have different perspectives on many things, so I am not too worried.
    if you started to agree with everything I say then I would really concerned that you might be more brain dead than me. :eek:
     
  10. NYCUA1K

    NYCUA1K Gold Member

    Messages:
    4,741
    Likes Received:
    5,088
    Status Points:
    4,270
    I am not sure whether anyone has put together a spreadsheet of the "value" (very subjective term) of loyalty miles or points, but there is definitely an algorithm that one can use to get an objective estimate of the "value" of a point or a mile to where fair-minded people can agree.

    I believe that by "value" the OP meant monetary value, in which case there are three distinct possibilities, which would determine the overall "value" of a point or mile. On the input side, there is (a) monetary value to purchase a point or mile, (b) monetary value to earn a point or mile from one's spend, and, on the output side, (c) monetary value of a point or mile on redemption. The rule of thumb is that points/miles will usually cost a lot more when they are redeemed, and it is the ratio of the input (earning) vs. output (redemption) that determines the overall "value" of a point or a mile. For instance, in the case of Hilton Honors points currently one can:
    a. purchase HH points for 100 points/$
    b. earn HH points on paid stays at a rate of at least 10/$ (at least 30/$ for Diamonds)
    c. redeem HH points at the very best properties for 200/$

    You purchase one HH point for 1 cent and redeem at 0.5 cent/point...It is even worse when one redeems earned points.

    Each of the above can be estimated objectively, with the most objective monetary value of a point or a mile being what a frequent guest or flyer program thinks their point/mile is worth in hard money; just go to their website and see how much it would cost in real money to buy a point or mile. The other two (b,c) depend on one's travel pattern, elite status, etc, so that, while they can be objectively estimated, they require more background data. Armed with such objective estimates of the "value" of a point or mile, it is possible to assess the relative "values" of various programs or options within a single program. For an example, please check this post, followed by this one in an another thread. There is no spreadsheet there, but an implementation of the algorithm that can be used to estimate the "value" of a point or mile can be seen.

    The short of it is that because individual circumstances vary widely, each person must ultimately decide what works for them and what it is worth to them, hence the subjectivity of "value". We can, however, learn from other people's experiences, which is the objective value of sites like MilePoint.;)
     
    garyst16 and TravelBear like this.
  11. RestlessLocationSyndrome
    Original Member

    RestlessLocationSyndrome Silver Member

    Messages:
    1,014
    Likes Received:
    1,356
    Status Points:
    925
    I think it is best for people to re-assess point valuation on an ongoing basis based upon their next award. This way you are at least tying your earning to your next immediate use of those points.

    One day you might be using DL miles to fly to Asia in business with a partner and next day, you're only using them to fly DL metal w/in the US... quite different valuations should your use for them change. Same works with hotels... Hilton pts for my next NYC trip is not very good but if I'm going to the Doubletree Beijing, I'd be shooting for those pts first.
     
    HaveMilesWillTravel likes this.
  12. NYCUA1K

    NYCUA1K Gold Member

    Messages:
    4,741
    Likes Received:
    5,088
    Status Points:
    4,270
    Given personal data and travel plans, it is possible to redeem in a way that minimizes the "cost function", thereby maximizing the benefits. The loyalty programs would like for the members to redeem at a loss (viz., "devaluation") because if they give fewer freebies, their profit would be maximized. Therefore, one has got to know the system in order to work it to one's advantage. That is what the mile/point gurus, who purport to dispense wisdom, generally do..
     
  13. Globalflyer
    Original Member

    Globalflyer Silver Member

    Messages:
    86
    Likes Received:
    75
    Status Points:
    305
    Here is how I personally value them when deciding if should burn or earn

    AA/UA/US miles: 1.5 US Cents
    DL miles: 1.1 US Cents

    SPG points: 2 - 2.5 US Cents
    Marriott points: 1 US Cent
    HH/CC/PC points: 0.4 - 0.6 US Cents
     
  14. Boraxo

    Boraxo Silver Member

    Messages:
    145
    Likes Received:
    139
    Status Points:
    420
    +1 - pretty close to my actuals though I generally shoot for 2cpm on UA and sometimes better on domestic F. My last PC redemptions were >1cpm at European IC hotel but this summer's HIX is only .8cpm under the old chart, closer to .5 on the new chart. For Marriott I am happy if I can get 1.2cpm but difficult to do that.

    I would also add:

    AS miles: 1 US cent (similar to DL - very hard to find saver awards)
    WN points: 1.67 US cent ( based on WGA advance purchase fares)
    Hyatt points: 2 US cents
     
  15. servo

    servo Silver Member

    Messages:
    736
    Likes Received:
    1,031
    Status Points:
    825
    How about UR points? To me, all the valuable transfer options (UA and WN, among others) make them a very valuable point to achieve. To me, they're more valued than MR points, because SPG tends to take a little luster away from MR points with its earning and transfer power. I feel like UR points are worth in the same 2-2.5 cent range as SPG, but I haven't really quantified that with realized math yet.
     
  16. edekba

    edekba Gold Member

    Messages:
    3,462
    Likes Received:
    3,783
    Status Points:
    2,145
    Isn't UR dependent upon what you're doing with them. PH stays? F/J on united?

    Way too many options IMO.

    All I know is I value them more than UA/HGP just for the fact that I can transfer them at will
     
  17. servo

    servo Silver Member

    Messages:
    736
    Likes Received:
    1,031
    Status Points:
    825
    I don't think there's any hard and fast answer. I might be one that places a value on simply the ability to transfer to partners at will (like you said), rather than the ultimate redemption - because I think there really is a value in having that choice of where to transfer, because even if redemption isn't strong in a particular program, it can still be a worthwhile transaction if you're earning the points cheaper than they gain you at redemption. I recently did a 23k point redemption for a RT MCO-ATL on WN for the NCAA basketball Final Four last minute, so it wasn't worth a lot in cpp (1.66 or whatever the WN standard is), but worth more to me because I didn't have to pay cash for a last minute ticket and I can still earn points for cheaper than I spend them. Now, how you quantify that value is up for debate.
     
    edekba likes this.
  18. edekba

    edekba Gold Member

    Messages:
    3,462
    Likes Received:
    3,783
    Status Points:
    2,145
    exactly. Everyone keeps asking what is cpm of xxx/yyy/zzz. And honestly ... i dont believe anyone can give you a concrete number or even a range. If the miles/points get you to where you need to go (or let you stay where you need to stay) and you can't afford it, cash wise, then isnt the value technically priceless?
     
    servo likes this.

Share This Page