Rumored Revenue Based Qualification Method

Discussion in 'United Airlines | MileagePlus' started by MilesGuy, Aug 11, 2011.  |  Print Topic

  1. Misplaced Texan
    Original Member

    Misplaced Texan Gold Member

    Messages:
    16,867
    Likes Received:
    26,140
    Status Points:
    20,020
    I'll be interested to see if it is.

    Lucky is an experienced traveler, but I'm not sure whether his "source" is reliable or if this is speculation...guess we'll see.

    I will say that this may benefit me long-term because my business travel is domestic but relatively costly while my international travel is self-paid. So if the trade-off is $8k in total revenue for SWUs that are good on all fares, I might come out ahead.
     
  2. I thought it's $20K for the top tier in the rumored new program? $8K is in addition to EQM or EQS. $20K alone gets your top tier. 4 segments is a piece of cake just to make sure you at least take 1-2 RTs on United metal.

     
  3. adambadam
    Original Member

    adambadam Silver Member

    Messages:
    473
    Likes Received:
    384
    Status Points:
    595
    Unless you get in the upgrade queue behind all the people on Miles+Copay regardless of status (unless GS) as Lucky alludes to. Then what good is a SWU if you can't use it.
     
    mht_flyer likes this.
  4. HaveMilesWillTravel
    Original Member

    HaveMilesWillTravel Gold Member

    Messages:
    12,503
    Likes Received:
    20,197
    Status Points:
    16,520
    That will make the "riots" over the recent Delta changes look like nothing..
     
  5. Misplaced Texan
    Original Member

    Misplaced Texan Gold Member

    Messages:
    16,867
    Likes Received:
    26,140
    Status Points:
    20,020
    Right, but I was thinking about my personal case where I:
    a) Fly 100k miles+ per year and
    b) Probably spend in excess of $8k per year already but
    c) Spend most of that on domestic late-purchase tickets and would benefit from being able to apply SWUs on cheaper international fares while still getting status on the back of my domestic work travel spend.
     
  6. Misplaced Texan
    Original Member

    Misplaced Texan Gold Member

    Messages:
    16,867
    Likes Received:
    26,140
    Status Points:
    20,020
    Unlike the legend of "no NC space," I've had pretty good luck finding open NC space on the flights I want to take. So unless they change those rules too, I'm not going to have to worry about wait list ordering.
     
  7. HaveMilesWillTravel
    Original Member

    HaveMilesWillTravel Gold Member

    Messages:
    12,503
    Likes Received:
    20,197
    Status Points:
    16,520
    Do we have any stats on miles+copayment usage? I can't imagine that there are many people who are willing to fork over $500 + 30k RDM after (as is often claimed) selecting the airline/flight primarily based on price.
     
  8. viguera
    Original Member

    viguera Gold Member

    Messages:
    4,737
    Likes Received:
    6,913
    Status Points:
    4,745
    I think the analysis is spot on, but it remains to be seen if the data is actually accurate. It makes perfect sense though when you think about it -- from their POV.

    People notice (and have posted here) all the time about the large quantity of Elite members. Whether it's at boarding or when you're trying to find award eligibility, it seems almost too easy to qualify.

    Now United seems to be taking a step back and figuring out that frequency is not necessarily a good measure of loyalty. Doing a few low-cost MRs and bulking up on the segments doesn't *really* earn them much, so they're looking at people that actually spend money as being more valuable, which is understandable.

    Still sucks though, but what are you gonna do...
     
    cordray2643 likes this.
  9. However it may cause business travelers to wait until the last minute to book high priced tickets just because they can because their company is paying. This drives up corporate travel expenses and sooner or later corporate travel departments may choose not to renew their UA contract. This will be a revenue loser when you start losing a bunch of corporate contracts.

     
  10. HaveMilesWillTravel
    Original Member

    HaveMilesWillTravel Gold Member

    Messages:
    12,503
    Likes Received:
    20,197
    Status Points:
    16,520
    I wonder if this was leaked deliberately to (a) get a sense for the response and (b) to give AA, DL and US a "heads up" so they can start planning their own version of this approach...
     
    goalie likes this.
  11. fadeforward

    fadeforward Active Member

    Messages:
    5
    Likes Received:
    3
    Status Points:
    90
    United needs to address these rumors PRONTO. Lucky is taken seriously enough that many, including me, will start cutting travel on United this year, anticipating that benefits will be cut next year. I already have a friend who has decided to book WN/B6/VX instead of gunning for 2P.

    IMO, there is no way they'll be able to implement this next year. They can announce it now for 2013, but that would be poor strategy. Better to cut slowly and scatter a few benefits in to maintain goodwill. We'll be here in 5 years, not next year.
     
  12. demkr
    Original Member

    demkr Silver Member

    Messages:
    110
    Likes Received:
    80
    Status Points:
    310
    If this is implemented in any way/shape/form, AA will have me back as a customer faster than you can say "Jeff Smisek."

    And if all the legacy carriers bow down to this, if it is indeed implemented, then it's been a fun mileage running ride.
     
    Scottrick and JLSocks like this.
  13. adambadam
    Original Member

    adambadam Silver Member

    Messages:
    473
    Likes Received:
    384
    Status Points:
    595
    The other big question is about how they calculate revenue? There is lots of room for discrepancy. Will only UA/CO metal flights count? What about code shares? Special revenue sharing agreements (ie LH trans Atlantic)? Does YQ get included? I could see someone buying a ticket through a 3rd party getting charged a booking fee and being upset that isn't included. What about BOB, Gogo or RCC membership?
     
    Scottrick and yaychemistry like this.
  14. tjtenor4
    Original Member

    tjtenor4 Gold Member

    Messages:
    1,261
    Likes Received:
    1,949
    Status Points:
    1,120
    For heaven's sakes, people...

    Yes, my first reaction was "wow."

    My second reaction, though, was "if I were to design a frequent flyer program, this is just about exactly how I'd do it."

    And I bet, deep down, most of y'all feel the same.
     
    cheepneezy, Ygor, bobsgt and 5 others like this.
  15. HaveMilesWillTravel
    Original Member

    HaveMilesWillTravel Gold Member

    Messages:
    12,503
    Likes Received:
    20,197
    Status Points:
    16,520
    I haven't done the math, but I suspect my 1K cost isn't significantly below $8K (assuming taxes, fees don't count, need to look at the numbers in more detail). Impact would likely be more significant for my wife (1P) with the loss of half the elite RDM bonus. I wonder if/how they'll plan to compensate the mid tiers for that change. Maybe 2/4/6 SWUs for Gold/Plat/Diamond?
     
  16. rwoman
    Original Member

    rwoman Gold Member

    Messages:
    5,617
    Likes Received:
    13,489
    Status Points:
    11,070
    I was thinking the same!! ;)
     
    kwai likes this.
  17. kwai
    Original Member

    kwai Gold Member

    Messages:
    5,977
    Likes Received:
    12,916
    Status Points:
    11,070
    I have one ecert that needs to be used soon and will do that. Afterwards, until this gets clarified, I'll be sitting back and watching.
     
  18. kwai
    Original Member

    kwai Gold Member

    Messages:
    5,977
    Likes Received:
    12,916
    Status Points:
    11,070
    And will Type B vouchers, such as from VDBs, be deducted from your spend?
     
  19. kwai
    Original Member

    kwai Gold Member

    Messages:
    5,977
    Likes Received:
    12,916
    Status Points:
    11,070
    Another big hit right there. The miles aren't a problem but getting spend to the $6K level just isn't going to happen (strike 1). Less RDMs (Strike 2). SWUs already issued ranking behind other upgrades (Strike 3).

    If this moves forward as rumored I walk away. I'm done.
     
    ande777emt likes this.
  20. ande777emt
    Original Member

    ande777emt Gold Member

    Messages:
    3,745
    Likes Received:
    5,827
    Status Points:
    4,170
    Looking at this possibility of revenue based status and the downgrades, AA is looking much better to me as well.
     
    JLSocks, sobore, canucklehead and 2 others like this.
  21. kwai
    Original Member

    kwai Gold Member

    Messages:
    5,977
    Likes Received:
    12,916
    Status Points:
    11,070
    With DL's bombshell a few days ago and UA right on their heels you have to wonder what AA has up their sleeve.

    Even if these recent developments are a huge push to pull back a little and say 'see, we listen' the game has changed.

    Someone on TOBB mentioned this, and as it's quite a good parallel I'll paraphrase it, the middle tiers are getting squeezed while the upper class are getting the benes. Kind of sounds familiar doesn't it?:(
     
  22. tom911
    Original Member

    tom911 Gold Member

    Messages:
    2,005
    Likes Received:
    3,183
    Status Points:
    2,070
    AA could just turn off the mileage counter and go to strictly points which is an alternative measure to elite status that's already in place. With deep discount coach fares it would take 200,000 miles at .5 points each to give you 100EQP for top tier status, and less than that with higher priced fares which have a higher point ratio (currently 100K of flying in deep discount fares gets you EXP). Personally, I think AA will take advantage of the situation, if it does come about, by courting UA flyers and by not getting into bed with UA. Time will tell. Of course, their route network is not an extensive, and they do rely on partners on routes where UA flies their own aircraft (ICN, SYD, SIN, for example). Can't use AA systemwides on any of those. It works for me as I use miles in that direction. Some Cathay fares don't even accumulate miles, and some Qantas fares only 50%. Very different structure than UA.

    UA does have a history of retreating, though, and I would not take that off the table quite yet. Back around 2000, when systemwides could be used on any fare, they raised the lowest to H, and then backed down from that and stuck with W fares. Just this year they reversed themselves on a new boarding process.

    As they haven't officially published a single change yet, plenty of time to tweak whatever they do put out. I'm just not sure we've seen the final version and they may have deliberately released it just to see what kind of response it would get from flyers.
     
  23. canucklehead
    Original Member

    canucklehead Gold Member

    Messages:
    5,895
    Likes Received:
    22,059
    Status Points:
    11,070
    Dislike the downgrade of the mileage bonus for the platinum and lower levels and that miles+copay > SWU.

    I would still want to go for the 1K/Diamond level, but not sure if I have 8K in spending (I probably do, but I would have to check). Can they even track that well enough given all the partners, channels for purchase, currency exchanges, mixed tickets (like if you have one segment on a ticket with a partner and the rest with non-partners).

    Overall this is a huge downgrade of the program in my eyes (and no mention of # SWUs, CR1s and what routes/fare codes that will apply) and makes me instantly consider the other programs to look at. In addition, frequent flyers no longer getting priority with SWUs vs miles+$ tells me that that the certs may have less value.

    Knowing that this information is circulating, I will have to seriously look at programs like AA or others. My loyalty goes as far as a program is loyal to me as a frequent customer.
     
  24. Canadi>n
    Original Member

    Canadi>n Gold Member

    Messages:
    1,956
    Likes Received:
    1,617
    Status Points:
    1,120
    Interesting if true. But the revenue qualifications are actually quite modest when one considers a 1K should be generating $20K+ in business for UA. (Though does the revenue only apply to UA/CO purchases? Guess it does as it would be hard for UA to calculate our fares when flying other STAR partners.) Agree with minimum amount of UA metal flights, actually should be higher. COS bonuses will significantly make achieving higher tiers easier for high spenders, but also suggests that GS may be wound down as these revenue and COS bonuses would easily give even limited CIP fliers top tier.

    As for upgrade priority, doubt there are many non-elites buying full Y and requesting upgrades with miles, but will this mean confirmation of our SWU or CR1 upgrades will come closer to travel date after UA assumes it has sold as many full fare seats as are likely, and processed any of these upgrades?

    Four tiers, but does STARGold still kick in at 50K? Suppose it does. E+ reserved seating for Premiers is a bit of a kick in the shins, but since the new UA is spreading it onto CO metal suggests the revenue generated by providing such seats to non-elites is significant and UA wants to ensure lots more up buys.
     

Share This Page