QF's woes according to Joyce

Discussion in 'Qantas Airways | Frequent Flyer' started by Globaliser, Feb 7, 2011.  |  Print Topic

  1. Globaliser
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    Globaliser Silver Member

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    Alan Joyce has been making some interesting comments in recent days about the business, following the release of figures showing another drop in QF's market share for international to/from Australia (with more in this article).

    If things really are that serious (are they?), flying a few hundred Aussies back to Australia isn't going to make much difference even if that creates some long-term brand loyalty amongst those who were helped (which is a big if). I'd be surprised if any brand problems really have arisen from recent mechanical incidents, or whether the market is reacting to the subtle shifts in the corporate attitude towards customers over the last few years.
     
  2. Rambuster
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    All the recent media attention to their technical problems probably didn't help their market share.
    I'm sure that the average consumer would be put off from flying QF for a while at least.
     
  3. Globaliser
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  4. Who's he got to blame though apart from himself? He was appointed into QF coming from a LCC background, of course his ways will start moulding QF. After the recent enhancements to the QF FF programme, I will flying all long haul on NZ and am starting to fly with DJ a lot more...
     
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  5. serfty
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    It will be interesting to see how he goes with DJ introducing a Business type service in the coming months.
     
  6. daedalus
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    Hopefully DJ will introduce a proper Business type service. Something better than that still born Premium Economy product.
     
  7. anat0l
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    anat0l Silver Member

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    Joyce can "woe is me, woe is QF" all he likes.

    I only care about what QF is going to do about it.

    And personally - I would cut all the rubbish about life not being fair, overpaid staff, greedy unions, unsupportive governments, high price of oil, unethical sensationalist popular media, overcapacity of the Australian market, etc. etc. Just get the job done! And preferably without playing the JQ card all the time...
     
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  8. daedalus
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    Joyce is doing what CEO's are paid to do. He says in the speech that he has no intention of letting the QF international product decay, and recognises that premium carriers still have a role to play.
     
  9. anat0l
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    Talk is cheap, and the international product may not be decaying per se but it certainly is not bringing in the desired market share.

    I don't think it's difficult to realise that premium carriers still have a role to play, although I do wonder to what extent does Joyce really think that a premium carrier is important and how much careful handling and attention is required to preserve that 'premium' integrity...
     
  10. daedalus
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    The seeds of the current problems were sewn way before Joyce took over the reins. Nevertheless, the first step to solving the problem, is to recognise you've got one. Joyce has taken that step. We'll just have to wait and see what the outcomes of the strategic review is to see what they come up with.
     
  11. Globaliser
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    I agree that that's logically the first step.

    However, I'm not yet convinced that Joyce even understands what the problem is. For example, this bit of his speech was rather striking:-
    Hello? Is there anything that says that Qantas is only for Australian customers? What about all the millions of other potential passengers at the other ends of the lines served by Qantas?

    Here's another example:-
    Qantas has done many good things for Australians, and perhaps gone above and beyond for them on many occasions.

    But the question remains: What about the rest of the world? One of the things that led to me drifting away from QFFF was the sense that QF just didn't care about customers outside Australia. What started as a bit of a joke about there never being any special offers for UK members stopped being funny after a while. Perhaps it was, all along, a reflection of the parochial attitude revealed by this speech.

    Such an attitude won't work any more in the 21st century. Emirates, for example, does not exist to serve Emiratis - there are virtually none of them, anyway. It's an airline that is pretty much as cosmopolitan as its home base. Perhaps it represents the other end of the spectrum, but Qantas has to realise that a blinkered approach to where it is and who it serves is may be one of its big underlying problems.

    However, if Joyce's strategic review works within the confines of the attitude revealed by his speech, I fear that it may simply miss that completely.
     
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  12. anat0l
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    That's a bit of a mismatch. The quote that Joyce gives (for no reason I can think of except lack of modesty) is supposed to demonstrate that QF has a role to play as a 'citizen' and giving back to the community, especially the one in which it calls its home / host.

    It would be good in a social and human sense for QF to be a global citizen and contribute to the rest of the world - as your question initially I thought would lead, but instead you have suggested what QF can do for the rest of the world as far as the business is concerned. And that's a whole different angle / issue.
     
  13. Globaliser
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    I was using the statement about the "good deeds" as a second illustration of a possible focus that does impact on the business.

    To put it another way, there's an underlying question that Qantas needs to answer: Is Qantas too Australian for its own good?

    And in the shorter term, whatever the true answer to the underlying question, there's something that the strategic review ought to ask: Does Qantas realise that it needs to ask itself that question?
     
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  14. kiwi
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    kiwi Gold Member

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    On a similar vein I had to laugh (it was either that or choke) when there was an item on the news in NZ about the 737-800 open day in Wellington. QF made a big deal about supporting New Zealand with the latest product.

    Umm - the withdrawal from NZ is almost complete and the only reason there are now new aircraft with latest product is the cruddy old ones finally outlived their useful life. It came across as a very arrogant and clueless thing to say, even to non frequent travellers.
     
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  15. wombat18
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    There's so much posturing going on, in advance of industrial action / union bargaining. The Age today suggests,


    "We are witnessing the demise of an icon through mismanagement," said Australian and International Pilots Association president Barry Jackson.​

    "This is not the first time some of the Qantas managers have been through this. Many were centrally involved in the destruction of Ansett and Australian Airlines and back then, as they are today, the same industrial consultants are advising them."​
    .

    .
     
  16. eightblack
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    I think there are many Aussies who still love the QF brand, but who don't fly the airline. They are my choice domestically (and will pay a slight premium to fly them). But they are not my choice internationally. They're just not competitive anymore - both hard and soft product. And price.

    And I'm sick of them blaming everyone from the pilots union, the inequity they see in the competitive landscape, the fuel costs, the flooding of capacity and everything else in between.

    Just get on with and deliver a consistent product, price it competitively and treat the frequent flyer base with the respect it deserves.
     
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  17. infoworks
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    Being based in Oz, it's hard to avoid QF, and I have to say that general onboard experience has improved (I have also been able to have a lot of A380 F travel). I agree they should get on with business and stop whining.

    I have an upcoming trip and CX on similar route (that actually suits me better) is 50% less than QF and still get the status credits and great service. I have my 4 segements on QF metal, why would I pay so much more than necessary for same (business) class of service?
     
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  18. moa999
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    a massive amount of postering, but think we will see some IR action out of this unfortunately
     
  19. haydensydney
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    haydensydney Silver Member

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    Joyce is packing a sad. Boo hoo.

    Perhaps if Joyce and his exec got their A into G and developed a decent product that enticed the public to fly them, perhaps they would be doing better? God knows what they were thinking with that 7 abreast J cabin on the new A330's and I don't know about you, but flying J DOM is pathetic. I can't believe that they won best wine in the skies when last time I flew SYD-DRW-SYD they had a Vasse Felix Sav and a random red (White or Red, sir?). Ugh No thanks.

    I feel much better after getting that off my chest [​IMG]
     
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  20. trippin_the_rift
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    Exactly and that's what is happening with QF, they are becoming a sugar and flour business where competition is on the same (or better) level and all they have to compete with now is price.
     

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