North Vancouver man finally filed YQ lawsuit against JAL

Discussion in 'JAL | Mileage Bank' started by JALPak, Sep 10, 2011.  |  Print Topic

  1. JALPak
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    JALPak Gold Member

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    This guy filed whole bunch of lawsuits against different carriers who collect YQ. He filed one against CX last month and now one against JAL. He claims that the fuel surcharge is misrepresented as some kind of tax or fee collected by a third party other than the airline...:rolleyes:

    What the hell he's talking about, JAL clearly indicates that's a fuel surcharge when you buy the ticket on its website. They even say it's Airline Fuel Surcharge. If they think they have a valid case, why not sue for the Airline Insurance Surcharge too :rolleyes:

    Screen shot 2011-09-09 at 9.50.32 PM.png

    Maybe he's talking about the e-ticket receipt, which only shows the YQ code for BOTH airline fuel surcharge and insurance charge. But by the time you see the e-ticket receipt, you would have already issued the ticket and agreed to pay the surcharge already. If you book through a travel agent, they should tell you want this is if you have doubt. If bought from JAL website, it clearly indicates it's the airline fuel surcharge and airline insurance surcharge, which he said it's acceptable.

    Screen shot 2011-09-10 at 2.29.17 AM.png

    And did I mention he wants to make this a class action lawsuit too? :eek: Good luck to make your case.

    For full story, you can visit: http://www.vancouversun.com/news/North Vancouver sues Japan Airlines/5380353/story.html
     
  2. Simon
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    Only in Canada........ Sounds like he doesn't have much of a case.

    *Edit* amended to Canada.
     
  3. JALPak
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    It's CANADA not America! All other cases haven't been dismissed...so we will see

    But if they win and someone starts similar cases in the US, I might be able to get quite a bit back LOL
     
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  4. NYBanker
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    Litigation-crazed Canadians...
     
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  5. NYBanker
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    The footer total line, in red, does describe everything as taxes. While the detail is clear, labeling the total in red as taxes is a bad fact for the carriers.

    While it is pretty clear that carriers more often than not don't highlight the fact that they keep a big chunk of the ancillary line items, they do clearly disclose the total cost of the ticket (online or on the phone) before you commit to the purchase. If you don't like the total, don't take the trip.

    Compare the carriers' behavior to restaurants in the US and Canada. There, a nominal price appears in the menu, but taxes and expected tips typically add up to another 25%. The exact amout due isn't really known till after you've committed (eaten the food).
     
  6. JALPak
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    you are right, i didn't notice that part. But to get to that page, you would have to click the link that says taxes and Surcharges. Anyway I agree that JAL should change the wording on the breakdown page to avoid confusion. By the way, the Japanese version of the page also show them as total taxes. I have notified JAL regarding this problem. Let's see when (or if) they will make the change

    Screen shot 2011-09-10 at 7.41.02 AM.png
     
  7. JALPak
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    Does it sound like he has a case now since the total is displayed as total taxes on the website?
     
  8. JALPak
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    For comparison, CX has the same problem too...theirs is even more confusing

    Fare details page is good. It shows Tax/Surcharge

    Screen shot 2011-09-10 at 8.15.53 AM.png

    But once you click the link, it has a similar break down page. They clearly states it's imposed by carriers but then use the type "Tax Price", "Tax Details", "Tax Code", and "Total Taxes" LOL

    Screen shot 2011-09-10 at 8.15.22 AM.png
     
  9. DLroads
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    I hope s/he wins just to stop this practice. 99.9% of the customers do believe it is a tax, and do not understand the differences between taxes and fees imposed. For them, it's the same 'punishment'.

    I really hope some judges with consumer protection views would enforce airlines to add the 'fees' to the base, and avoid this misleading approach.
     
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  10. JALPak
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    What's the difference to the consumer whether it's tax, fee or part of the base fare? Either way the total you have to pay is the same unless you are talking about award redemption.
     
  11. Simon
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    Sorry amended to Canada. So JAL's already started taking action and making changes hmmmmm
     
  12. JALPak
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    what are you talking about it has always been this way
     
  13. savydog
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    The thing I do not like is when a fare is advertised as a sale price of $28* and then it is actually $65 when you try to book it. You expect a few add ons with the * but Tiger in Australia got so bad that I do not check their specials any more. ( yes they got grounded for other reasons but may be back ..... yawn :))
     
  14. JALPak
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    They don't do that in the US. They advertise base fare + surcharges. The only charges that's missing are the taxes and fees collected by third parties
     
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  15. QSG
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    Oh the pathos !
     
  16. sendaiben
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    I agree. Why not just call it the price? Why have the price, and then the extra price? I find it misleading and dishonest too :confused:
     
  17. JALPak
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    Cuz if they want to adjust the price they need to get approval. Given the volatility of jet fuel price, it's easier to just add YQ on top and adjust them base on route/zone using a fixed formula.
     
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  18. sendaiben
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    The airlines should at least have the decency to quote the 'real price' in advertising, on their websites, etc.

    Quoting one price, then doubling it at the end of the booking process, is just obnoxious :mad:
     
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  19. HaveMilesWillTravel
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    What's the difference to the airline? They are presenting it as something that it isn't. It's part of the cost of doing business, just like salaries, food, airplane maintenance. But the way they show it, the customer is mislead to think the big, bad government is collecting a huge chunk of their overall cost of the ticket (much bigger than in reality).

    Would you think it would be fair for McDonald's to also add an "energy surcharge" on top of the menu price to cover the cost of electricity/gas to cook the burger?
     
  20. JALPak
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    That's exactly what CX does on its HK website.
     
  21. JALPak
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    The difference is YQ doesn't count towards the commission in some places. When you get a quote on JAL North America website, it always show you the all in price. So yes it's fare as long as McD put the energy surcharge on its menu.

    To the consumer, it doesn't matter. You only have two choices, pay the total price or bring your business to somewhere else. Whether it's tax or surcharge, you don't have a choice not to pay them if you want to fly with the carrier.
     
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  22. HaveMilesWillTravel
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    So they are "scamming" the travel agents and misrepresenting the actual amount of money paid to the airline by the traveler.

    It matters to me because I believe in transparency. This is just a slimy business practice, just like resort fees. Do you think it's fair to charge fuel surcharges on award tickets, for example?
     
  23. JALPak
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    That's part of the contract which the TA and airlines agree on. YQ has been in place forever. They could fight back or negotiate higher commission when they renew their contract if they want. In some cases, they do fight back and end up getting more commission. It's a mutual agreement not scamming.

    The prices are clearly broken down into base fares, surcharges, taxes, fees. How is that not transparent? :rolleyes: Even the mechanism of determining YQ level are disclosed on the website for JAL and ANA. You can even tell the maximum amount they will charge before they announce the next revision.

    I don't mind paying YQ on awards at all. Would you rather have the airlines adjust the award redemption rates to reflect the current cost of your award ticket instead?
     
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  24. HaveMilesWillTravel
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    Again, it's a cost of doing business just like labor, airport gate rental, plane cleaning, food, executive bonus plans ... that should be built into the cost of revenue and award tickets.
     
  25. JALPak
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    Except jet fuel price is extremely volatile compared to all other costs.
     

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