Do we take it all for granted?

Discussion in 'General Discussion | Travel' started by gregm, Mar 8, 2014.  |  Print Topic

  1. gregm

    gregm Gold Member

    Messages:
    1,508
    Likes Received:
    2,161
    Status Points:
    1,200
    After today's news about Malaysian Airlines and then thinking back about Asiana Airlines at SFO, I was thinking about air travel and everything associated with making it all safe. Think about it, there's the human factor; equipment and it's maintenance (not to mention quality of production), the pilots skill and experience, the ATC system, keeping everyone from flying into each other as well as other factors such as weather and another human factor I omitted..those who wish to do harm.

    I'm definitely not a negative person, but sometimes I find myself sitting in my seat, wondering if the equipment I'm on will lose a vital part, or will another aircraft come to close, or will wind shear slam us to the runway a few seconds too soon.

    It's all a intricate integration of the the factors we can control and those we cannot.

    Am I getting too deep? ;)
     
    Mapsmith and blackjack-21 like this.
  2. Mapsmith
    Original Member

    Mapsmith Gold Member

    Messages:
    2,930
    Likes Received:
    7,696
    Status Points:
    6,570
    Nah. To be expected after a tragedy like Malaysian. I often think about flying in the MD-80's. 88's and 90's and thinking about the ages of those planes and the fact that most are being flown almost continuously. However, I do realize that theoretically an engine seems to last longer if it is not going through the shut down/start up procedure too often. (Oil keeps going if the engine is on. And the operating temperature stays more stable)

    Do I wonder if my plane will stay in the air. Not really. Bernoulli makes sure that happens and the airlines can not continue to stay in business if their planes do not stay in the air.

    Air Travel is still the safest method of travel. So, I will continue to keep flying.
     
    KENNECTED, blackjack-21 and gregm like this.
  3. blackjack-21

    blackjack-21 Gold Member

    Messages:
    1,437
    Likes Received:
    3,000
    Status Points:
    1,910
    Definately some food for thought here......but I'm not THAT hungry. Flying is still one of the safest means of transportation, and if one looks at the odds, it beats walking. :)
     
    Mapsmith and gregm like this.
  4. gregm

    gregm Gold Member

    Messages:
    1,508
    Likes Received:
    2,161
    Status Points:
    1,200
    There are other models of a similar age in service, too! Delta has plenty of old 757s. I'm a true believer that they can almost fly forever if maintained. That does, however, depend on the equality of maintenance. Last year I flew 135 segments. 135 takeoffs and landings. Ugh, 135 safety demos/videos. I didn't think about it each time, but as you said, I guess after something like this happens.
     
    Mapsmith and blackjack-21 like this.
  5. gregm

    gregm Gold Member

    Messages:
    1,508
    Likes Received:
    2,161
    Status Points:
    1,200
    It's my preferred means of transportation. I think it's :cool:
     
    Mapsmith likes this.
  6. blackjack-21

    blackjack-21 Gold Member

    Messages:
    1,437
    Likes Received:
    3,000
    Status Points:
    1,910
    Greg....I really enjoy the rocket-like takeoff of a B757, but even those too are slowly (not slow enough IME) being replaced by the newer fly-by-wire plasticized behemouth jets. I'm beginning to have some hesitations about the latter models what with all the bugs showing up so frequently, such as the battery fires and now cracks in B787 wings, which if I remember, were also evident in A380's at some time. These are new aircraft types, and I'm sure all the problems will eventually be worked out, as they sometime have in new car models, which is why, although all the cars in my lifetime have been bought brand new, still I won't by a new model car in it's first year of production, as I'd rather wait for a year or two to let the producer work out the bugs and flaws. Looking at some of the new aircraft products, my thoughts are to also wait on them for a bit too.

    And although my flight segmentations will never be anywhere near yours, even from way back when, or way back sooner, still I'm always always excited and a bit wonderstruck getting onto an aircraft at any time, with the thought of how that big bird can always get me off the ground and into the air, even though it's tons of weight (the plane, not me...yet) and then get me safely to my destination, and the other pax too, amazingly, although they`re only along for the ride, while I`m always enjoying it immensely!

    So for that reason, and that reason alone, I'll keep flappin' my wings every chance I get.

    We don't yet know what the probable cause was for MH370, but hopefully they'll find out soon. And I still don't accept the explanation for TWA800, but that won't stop me from boarding a plane anywhere or any time if we (my wife travels with me...we're now both retired) have to journey anywhere that's too far to drive. Since I don't usually swim TATL, I`ll leave my choice of travelling across the pond to an aircraft that`s ETOPS rated.
     
    Last edited: Mar 8, 2014
    Mapsmith and gregm like this.
  7. gregm

    gregm Gold Member

    Messages:
    1,508
    Likes Received:
    2,161
    Status Points:
    1,200
    The 757 is definitely one of my favorite narrow-bodies. I love the F cabin and 2nd boarding door. Love the takeoffs. I heard Delta was going to replace them with new 737s. While a tried and proven model, excluding the latest 'auto-thingy' problem, that is not a Boeing model I'm a fan of. I like the feel of a slightly larger aircraft.
     
    KENNECTED, Mapsmith and blackjack-21 like this.
  8. gregm

    gregm Gold Member

    Messages:
    1,508
    Likes Received:
    2,161
    Status Points:
    1,200
    Mapsmith likes this.
  9. blackjack-21

    blackjack-21 Gold Member

    Messages:
    1,437
    Likes Received:
    3,000
    Status Points:
    1,910
    Greg!!! The only time I EVER walk EVER, is indoors either at home or at a store or mall. I refuse to walk almost anywhere at my advanced agedness, preferring to drive instead, which I still do well, even after almost five and a half decades of driving, and even with all the nitwits on the roads today. And though they say there may be more accidents in the home then on a plane or in a car, I intend to keep my pedal to the metal and flap my wings more often then walking, for as long as I can.
     
    YULtide, Mapsmith and gregm like this.
  10. blackjack-21

    blackjack-21 Gold Member

    Messages:
    1,437
    Likes Received:
    3,000
    Status Points:
    1,910
    The B737-900 is only slightly smaller then a B757, so no significant difference exteriorwise. Interiorwise, however, there may be lot's to differentiate. The B757's fans however, being more overpowered then may be necessary, make their takoffs more like a rocket (although never having been in a rocket to compare it....!).
     
    Mapsmith and gregm like this.
  11. gregm

    gregm Gold Member

    Messages:
    1,508
    Likes Received:
    2,161
    Status Points:
    1,200
    It's too close to the ground. I like the height and stance of a 757. I also like the look. The lowered nose cone, as opposed to the centered one on the other Boeings, makes it look like it's ready to go! I'll sure miss the 2nd boarding door. I hate having everyone pass by.
     
    blackjack-21 and Mapsmith like this.
  12. gregm

    gregm Gold Member

    Messages:
    1,508
    Likes Received:
    2,161
    Status Points:
    1,200
    Umm, unless, of course, I'm one of the 'everyone'! :eek:
     
    icurhere2, Mapsmith and blackjack-21 like this.
  13. blackjack-21

    blackjack-21 Gold Member

    Messages:
    1,437
    Likes Received:
    3,000
    Status Points:
    1,910
    That's because on the -900 the engine pods are larger and more ground hugging. Droopy looking nose is one indication of a -57, as is the nose gear, looking like on a stilt. Definately a distinctive looking aircraft, from any angle. As far as the 2L door entrance, I wish they'd post some signage as we get on, because I always seem to be turning left when entering the plane, almost by instinct, until of course I'm grabbed by the seat my pants (no problem, it's my wife) and turned southward, much to my chagrin. And that's even after my usual quirk of a friendly pat on the aircraft's skin of each aircraft I've ever been on, as we're about to board from the jetway or steps.
     
    Mapsmith and gregm like this.
  14. Terry Yap

    Terry Yap Gold Member

    Messages:
    1,464
    Likes Received:
    2,934
    Status Points:
    1,425
    for one, i think a vast majority of us take the safety briefings for granted ! we probably lack appreciation for the ground and on board crew for checking and maintaining the likely 10 million parts of the aircraft to keep it airworthy and minimise danger...
     
    Mapsmith and gregm like this.
  15. gregm

    gregm Gold Member

    Messages:
    1,508
    Likes Received:
    2,161
    Status Points:
    1,200
    Agreed!
     
    Mapsmith likes this.
  16. gregm

    gregm Gold Member

    Messages:
    1,508
    Likes Received:
    2,161
    Status Points:
    1,200
    As long as we don't hold our breath waiting for the DL 787s.......
     
    Mapsmith and blackjack-21 like this.
  17. blackjack-21

    blackjack-21 Gold Member

    Messages:
    1,437
    Likes Received:
    3,000
    Status Points:
    1,910
    "As long as we don't hold our breath waiting for the DL 787s.......".

    No worries! Many airlines already have the -87's and I'm in no particular rush to jump on them when there's a myriad of other aircraft options still available. AC, BA and others have already taken delivery of some of their orders and still haven't reported many reliability problems as yet, although they're still subject to those worriesome battery problems as they keep appearing, and lately some hydraulics one's too.

    Since I can't very well hold my breath for very long while smoking one of my chain-smoked ciggies (cough,cough), that's not a viable option for me. And patience is definately not one of my virtuous virtues. My wife often reminds me of that latter fact by quoting a saying from a famously unknown saying maker:
    "Patience is a virtue, get it if you can.
    Seldom in a woman,
    But NEVER in a man"

    In my case, as I get older day by day (nights too), my patience seems to be fleetingly rarer.

    Hold on for a moment while I light up one of my chains.............!
     
    gregm and Mapsmith like this.
  18. NYBanker
    Original Member

    NYBanker Gold Member

    Messages:
    32,725
    Likes Received:
    191,901
    Status Points:
    20,020
    From time to time, I get a fear of flying (only during flying). It's certainly very modest on a scale of fears, but it is greater than zero.

    I'll go a few years without a concern...then a few flights will have me thinking about the risks...then back to usual.

    Indeed, regularly sending 242 foot metal tubes into the sky might not have been in the original plans for Earth. We do it pretty well, however.
     
  19. MJonTravel
    Original Member

    MJonTravel Silver Member

    Messages:
    178
    Likes Received:
    239
    Status Points:
    420
    I expect most of us think about it from time to time, especially in light of what has happened. I can honestly say it's not something I think about for more than a fleeting second. Nothing I can do about it for one. But primarily, having some experience in "the system" gives me confidence that things are probably gonna be OK. "Probably" might not sound confident...but I am.
     
    gregm and Mapsmith like this.
  20. MyTravels
    Original Member

    MyTravels Silver Member

    Messages:
    482
    Likes Received:
    352
    Status Points:
    570
    I worry about air travel no more than I do about the train, auto, bicycle, etc. Obviously on the latter two I'm paying a lot more attention to others on the road and their driving.
     
    gregm likes this.
  21. Bill Hunt

    Bill Hunt Silver Member

    Messages:
    249
    Likes Received:
    257
    Status Points:
    450
    We had many of the same considerations, as we flew into SFO on 28R, two days later. Very sobering experience.
     
    gregm likes this.
  22. TravelMusing

    TravelMusing Gold Member

    Messages:
    7,109
    Likes Received:
    51,398
    Status Points:
    12,475
    Hmmm... reading this thread is not helping me with my upcoming flight across the pond...

    The ocean is so vast... :eek:
     
    gregm likes this.
  23. Bill Hunt

    Bill Hunt Silver Member

    Messages:
    249
    Likes Received:
    257
    Status Points:
    450
    This very evening, my wife expressed the same sentiments, as we fly to LHR in April.

    Curious incident, and hope that we get some solid info - while I worry about implications, I would want to know that the 777 does not have some problem - lovely plane, and I respect it highly. Still, who knows what's up with MA370?

    Hunt
     
    gregm likes this.
  24. gregm

    gregm Gold Member

    Messages:
    1,508
    Likes Received:
    2,161
    Status Points:
    1,200
    I really hope this isn't the beginning of discovering 777 flaws. There's almost 1200 of them out there. What a mess that would be.
     
    blackjack-21 likes this.
  25. blackjack-21

    blackjack-21 Gold Member

    Messages:
    1,437
    Likes Received:
    3,000
    Status Points:
    1,910
    Unless they find something definately mechanical/maintenance/flawed/age related on any B777 model arising from the probable cause of MH370, I'd gladly get on one today if we could. Probably won't be flying TATL until early fall so the bugs, if any, should be discovered and corrected by then. The Asiana accident at SFO, while terrible, hasn't been proven at all to be any deficiency with the aircraft or any of it's systems, rather a human error with a pilot inexperienced on that type into SFO. At this point in time, the B777 still would be my choice, along with other Boeing models except for the B787, and the Airbus A380 whale, because of their still frequent bugs showing up.

    Hope they can find the wreckage soon to identify the probable cause, as the longer it`s lost the more difficult that may be.

    Somewhere in a box in the inards of our apartment locker, is a novel I bought years ago and read several times. It`s title is ``The Probable Cause`` by Ernest K. Ghan. While it talks about incidents from many years ago, still it gave some insights into the reason for some accidents, including pilot errors, as the human factor may sometimes have more to do with incidents then the aircraft themselves. Often it showed how the crew was able to overcome an aircraft problem and land safely. Same box has a paperback of the infamous AC ``Gimli Glider`` incident where a brand new B767 had a fuel starvation and shutdown of both engines in flight with an emergency glide-in to Gimli, Manitoba. Cause was not enough fuel loaded, and the crew not familiar with the conversion rates for the fuel at the time, but they did a fantastic job, including a long side-slope, in bringing that plane down safely. Plane was repaired (nose gear collapsed on landing) and was finally retired about a year ago after many, many years in service. I flew the same route a week later without incident (different aircraft type), but I did ask the captain to check his fuel before we left. We`ve flown on many B767`s since then.
     
    Last edited: Mar 13, 2014

Share This Page