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Discussion in 'SkyTeam' started by Lufthansa Flyer, Jun 24, 2011.
Very confusing/poorly written article, IMO.
That is a seriously stupid issue. I understand why some people are upset about doing business with the Kingdom. No problem, easy to understand. However, saying Saudi Arabia will not let Jews into the country is wrong. They do. That is not so suggest that they are paragons of any type of civil right or human right. They are not! However, they are not more obnoxious to Jews than they are to others, IME. I have traveled there many times and have never, ever had a problem getting visas for jewish colleagues. Never.
Comfortable or pleasant to be there. No. No. No. Particular discrimination against Pakistanis, Bangladeshis, Filipinos, and many others is real and visceral. There are so many special offensive practices I find it hard to count them. Oddly, Jews who enter are often treated with unusual deference, a type of discrimination all by itself.
It is really wrongheaded to make false claims against offensive regimes. Unnecessary and wrongheaded.
End of rant.
Those who have this issue should stop buying gasoline, too. (Except for gas at Citgo of course, which comes from Venezuela.)
Please also don't fly BA, AF, KL, etc...
I don't understand that! Outrageous! Our Hummers and Suburbans are our right! How can you connect these issues!
Seriously, now, would anybody prefer Chavez fuel to KSA fuel? You have raised the real issue. All the BRICS except R and B are heavy net importers as is all of Europe and North America. Foreign policy has been driven by petroleum since at least 1932 with KSA and the overthrow of the elected Iranian government in the 1950's. The little outrage here ignores the real issues, doesn't it?
Took me 4 re-reads and its still not perfectly clear what they're trying to accomplish.
No, these are trivial. Some loose codeshare relationship is the real straw that breaks the camels back!
What's the deal with uninformed media hack-jobs on Delta these days?
Reporters must all be *A flyers.....
Were you able to get a visa for a Jewish colleague holding an Israeli passport? Saudia Arabia, along with nearly all Middle East countries, will refuse entry to anyone holding a passport- or even an entry / exit stamp - from Israel. Seems crazy to hold this against Delta though. I'm not sure one could fly anywhere in the world if the criteria is an airline with no alliances, code shares, or routes to Saudia Arabia, Syria, Qutar, etc.
I guess all the alliances with members based in/flying to/from the Middle East should be pointed out? Amazing how people are misinformed and overreact...
That I never tried. I would be quite surprised were that to work given the Israeli visa/stamp issue. BTW, obviously having been to Israel is not an issue, only the documentation of the visit. Facts are not the problem, appearances are. I suppose that last sentence is true almost everywhere.
Consider the source(s). This is more about politics than about Delta. Todd Starnes and Fox News are not exactly a duo of journalist excellence nor are they "fair and balanced". Others have noted the lack of evidence and difficulty in following the allegation or point that Starnes is trying to make. Sometimes the point is just to fan the flames and create "controversy" where none exists. Now Delta has to prove that they are not discriminating against Jews because the charge has been levied. If you look at the list of Mr. Starnes columns they include a long list of hot button issues like sex education in Montana, schools censoring religious words at grad speech, atheists in New York city, and a number of race-baiting tweets etc about Muslims, blacks and the like. And of course the usual rants against Obama. Starnes has been hitting Delta since the luggage fee was charged for returning soldiers. Todd has a point of view and that passes for news at Fox. Media Matters does some error correcting on previous articles here http://mediamatters.org/search/tag/todd_starnes?tab=all. Let's see if Fact Check.org looks into this claim. The journalists at Fox keeps them pretty busy.
Fish sets the record straight!
Kalboz thanks for posting that great link that exposes the complete disregard for facts in the FOX story about Delta. We should all send a note to Mr. Starnes and FOX about this reporting. Sadly the fact checking rarely goes viral like the bogus allegations do. But that is part of the FOX strategy...and it works. There is NO consequence for playing fast and loose with the facts and this is a good example of why FOX viewers often rank as among the worst informed consumers of media. Delta should take them to court.
In the interest of the facts, this story did not originate on FOX. I didn't read the linked article, but in this case I've seen many different mainstream news media reporting on this "story" in similar uninformed fashion, although most admittedly lacked postings like this one.
http://www.poynter.org/latest-news/...ad-about-delta-jews-and-saudi-arabia-flights/ appears, at first glance, relatively complete. There are lots of things to point fingers at Fox News over, but I'm not sure this is the best one to choose.
I first saw this story on AOL.com and the Huffingtonpost. I believe that the story actually started at the Huffingtonpost and Foxnews and the other media outlets globbed on.
I just checked and the Huffingtonpost's article on this was published on 6/23/11, while Fox's article was published on 6/24/11. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/rabbi-jason-miller/delta-airlines-saudi-arabia_b_883202.html
Fox appears to have jumped on the bandwagon but not be the origination of this story, which is actually apparent from looking at the link Kalboz provides.
Fox is supposed to be an impartial news organization. HuffPo is a point-of-view political blog and Rabbi Jason Miller clearly is not neutral on this issue. Those reading a story by Todd Starnes on the FOX News website under "politics" consider this news- vetted news. Journalists are supposed to be reporting facts not repeating point of view materials as fact. And HuffPo should edit their contributors more carefully if they want to be taken seriously. I bet they will run a correction on this.
Fox is not the Daily Show w Jon Stewart (I actually think the TDS is more factual). It is not HuffPo or AOL. FOX is a "news network" or so they say. They all get it wrong sometimes. The difference is a reputable news organization will issue corrections or take down online articles like USA Today did with an admission that is was inaccurate. I have never seen FOX do that, so their viewers never know the truth. It's like Palin defending her Paul Revere remix and her defenders trying to edit Wikipedia. If the facts don't fit the narrative, make up new facts or stick to the bogus ones.
FOX has a right to tell whatever side of the story they want - I have no problem with that as long as they inform their viewers about their bias and lose the "fair and balanced" tag line. The fact that World Net Daily launched this story should have made everyone run for the hills in my opinion. This is SOP. WND runs a totally bogus story (un-vetted) and then it gets picked up by FOX and sometimes the MSM gets swept up in the cesspool of what passes for journalism. It's a complete embarrassment and part of the reason Americans are so uniformed on the issues that really matter. We are a People Magazine culture. Jon Stewart makes a good living mocking what passes for journalism and he has plenty of material. There are only a few news organizations that I respect. FOX is among the worst. That, of course, is just my opinion.