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Based on the information provided, at this point, the New Marriott Program is: Poll is created on April 19, 2018 10:07 am

  
  
  
Poll results: Based on the information provided, at this point, the New Marriott Program is:
Voter(s): 16
Poll is created on April 19, 2018 10:07 am
Better  -  votes: 7 / 43.8%
7
43.8%
No difference ❓  -  votes: 4 / 25%
4
25%
Worse  -  votes: 5 / 31.3%
5
31.3%

New Marriott Program  

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mattsteg
(@mattsteg)
Joined: 9 years ago
Posts: 3342
April 27, 2018 12:44 pm  

Are you tgat dense?

Your excerpts point to the exact issue I had mentioned - inability to grow fast enough to meet market demands. You can only build and reflag so fast, especially without many cheap brands.

That's a structural issue with building a hotel group dominated by full service and luxury properties, not a loyalty program one.

Silver Gold Executive Platinum Classic Plus Exec Elite Platinum Gold Diamond


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Counsellor
(@counsellor)
Joined: 9 years ago
Posts: 1556
April 27, 2018 1:53 pm  

NYCUA1K, post: 2813756, member: 43667 wrote: . . . Among its flaws were the reasons I already gave above, which related to how SPG turned the starpoint into an airline points currency. Part of the members' purportedly "fierce loyalty" was to the starpoint, which could be earned on CC spend and exchanged for free plane tickets, rather than from patronizing SPG and earning starpoints through revenue stays and redeeming them for award stays at 'aspirational' Starwood properties, which were almost an order of magnitude more expensive than the competition.

If the "flaw" causing SPG loss of revenue or of hotel patronage (if that indeed happened) was, as you suggest, the convertibility of Starpoints to airline miles at favorable rates, Marriott has deliberately exposed itself to that same "flaw" by incorporating it into the new program -- and exacerbated the "problem" by applying the convertibility at the favorable rate even to the "old" Marriott Rewards points being carried over to the new program.

To recap, the Starpoints convertibility you seem troubled by offered to exchange 20,000 Starpoints for 25,000 airline miles.

As I mentioned earlier, the "new" MR program continues the same convertibility model -- they converted Starppoints to MR points at a rate of 3 MR points for one Starpoint. They then offer to exchange MR points to airline miles at a 3 for 1 rate, but if you exchange in amounts of 60,000 MR points (i.e., what 20,000 Starpoints became) they will "give" you an additional 15,000 MR points so that you're exchanging 75,000 MR points for 25,000 airline miles.

So, you're still getting 25K airline miles for the MR equivalent of 20K Starpoints.

And, more importantly, you can exchange MR points you already have in your account, and any new ones you earn, at the same rate! If the poison was bad for Starpoints, it now infects all MR points as well! Shall we expect Marriott to see the "loss of revenue and of heads in beds" you seem to have seen with SPG?

I will agree that Marriott has not been as generous as SPG going forward, though. Instead of giving the equivalent of one Starpoint (3 MR points) per dollar charged to the credit card for non-Marriott spend, they will give only two MR points. This does reduce the value to the customer of the AMEX card, and it may be a ploy to drive that card out of the market.


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NYCUA1K
(@nycua1k)
Joined: 8 years ago
Posts: 4971
April 27, 2018 5:02 pm  

mattsteg, post: 2813790, member: 5563 wrote: Are you tgat dense?

Your excerpts point to the exact issue I had mentioned - inability to grow fast enough to meet market demands. You can only build and reflag so fast, especially without many cheap brands.

That's a structural issue with building a hotel group dominated by full service and luxury properties, not a loyalty program one.

If you want to launch insults, then make sure you are not simply "projecting" and the insults actually apply to you.

Check this out. "Slow growth was part of it, but falling profits when competitors were posting record profits was the biggest part because it also impeded growth."

See it right there in very simple English that I did acknowledge that slow growth was part of it? The question for you is why the slow growth when everyone else was thriving?

Also the WSJ article debunked this other bogus claim that you made: "Starwood Hotels was [sic] consistently more profitable than Marriott..." Total bunk.

I remember you from the past and had even blocked you for a time. Either stick to the issues or go away and insult someone your "size".

G'day.


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NYCUA1K
(@nycua1k)
Joined: 8 years ago
Posts: 4971
April 27, 2018 5:19 pm  

Counsellor, post: 2813796, member: 858 wrote: If the "flaw" causing SPG loss of revenue or of hotel patronage (if that indeed happened) was, as you suggest, the convertibility of Starpoints to airline miles at favorable rates, Marriott has deliberately exposed itself to that same "flaw" by incorporating it into the new program -- and exacerbated the "problem" by applying the convertibility at the favorable rate even to the "old" Marriott Rewards points being carried over to the new program.

To recap, the Starpoints convertibility you seem troubled by offered to exchange 20,000 Starpoints for 25,000 airline miles.

As I mentioned earlier, the "new" MR program continues the same convertibility model -- they converted Starppoints to MR points at a rate of 3 MR points for one Starpoint. They then offer to exchange MR points to airline miles at a 3 for 1 rate, but if you exchange in amounts of 60,000 MR points (i.e., what 20,000 Starpoints became) they will "give" you an additional 15,000 MR points so that you're exchanging 75,000 MR points for 25,000 airline miles.

So, you're still getting 25K airline miles for the MR equivalent of 20K Starpoints.

And, more importantly, you can exchange MR points you already have in your account, and any new ones you earn, at the same rate! If the poison was bad for Starpoints, it now infects all MR points as well! Shall we expect Marriott to see the "loss of revenue and of heads in beds" you seem to have seen with SPG?

I will agree that Marriott has not been as generous as SPG going forward, though. Instead of giving the equivalent of one Starpoint (3 MR points) per dollar charged to the credit card for non-Marriott spend, they will give only two MR points. This does reduce the value to the customer of the AMEX card, and it may be a ploy to drive that card out of the market.

The structure of transferring starpoints to miles has not changed. Marriott has simply crippled the value of their transferability by limiting how many can be earned on general spend. To earn significant numbers of starpoints (to be referred to simply as "points" after August 1), one has to do revenue stays at Marriott properties for 2x/$, or buy airline tickets or dine for 1x/$; spend on everything else will earn just 0.67x/$ and that's the killer. At the same time, Marriott has made the redemption of points for award stays more affordable than were SPG awards. Therefore, members have been forced to make a choice between transferring "points" earned mostly through hotel stays to miles or booking award stays at suddenly affordable 'aspirational' properties.

For those who play the game with a "full deck", the choice is a no-brainer...and Marriott wins by keeping most of the point activities tied to the company's core business...

G'day.


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Kalboz
(@kalboz)
Joined: 9 years ago
Posts: 11631
May 1, 2018 5:34 pm  

SPG Champion, post: 2813456, member: 5050 wrote: Travel Packages will continue to exist as they do today. We do have plans to announce new Travel Packages, coming summer 2018. Stay tuned for more information!

Best regards,

William R. Sanders
Social Media Specialist
Starwood Hotels & Resorts LLC

[EMAIL]spgchampion@starwoodhotels.com[/EMAIL]

How can members find out how many lifetime SPG points they have earned? And what's the conversion rate of these SPG LT points to the combines lifetime calculator after august 1st?

Tried to find out on the SPG website to no avail.

Thank you!

Our travel diaries on flickr


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SPG Champion
(@spg-champion)
Joined: 9 years ago
Posts: 1580
May 1, 2018 6:25 pm  

Kalboz, post: 2814003, member: 442 wrote: How can members find out how many lifetime SPG points they have earned?

SPG did not rely on this information for earning any level of lifetime status, so my best guess at the moment is that it is not retrievable and may be irrelevant.

And what's the conversion rate of these SPG LT points to the combines lifetime calculator after august 1st?

Tried to find out on the SPG website to no avail.

Thank you!

Isn't this available here: https://members.marriott.com/faq/#how-will-i-earn-points-as-an-spg-member-what-happens-to-my-existing-starpoints

"In August, Starpoints® will become points and your balance will be multiplied by three during a one-time conversion..."

Best regards,

William R. Sanders
Social Media Specialist
Starwood Hotels & Resorts LLC

[email]spgchampion@starwoodhotels.com[/email]


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JoyfulTraveler
(@joyfultraveler)
Silver
Joined: 7 years ago
Posts: 2
May 6, 2018 6:31 pm  

From a personal point of view, the combined program is a big plus for me. As a lifetime Marriott Platinum this means I have that status with both hotel groups for life. In the past, I would stay at a few Starwood properties each year. However, I was only lifetime Gold with Starwood. Now I will look not only at a high-end Marriott, J. W., Autograph Collection, etc but will now consider Westin, W, Luxury Collection etc. So many more choices.


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